Comments - Ireland's Tithe War: Income for Protestant Clergy With Steep Price - The Wild Geese2024-03-29T08:51:12Zhttps://thewildgeese.irish/profiles/comment/feed?attachedTo=6442157%3ABlogPost%3A190139&xn_auth=noThank you again Joe Many tho…tag:thewildgeese.irish,2016-09-26:6442157:Comment:2004732016-09-26T20:10:17.190Zmichael dunnehttps://thewildgeese.irish/profile/michaeldunne
<p>Thank you again Joe Many thoughts come to mind on the forty shilling payment, and much of which is a hazy memory of post school history. I am reminded of the difficulty the Duke of Wellington and PM Peele? had in granting Catholic Emancipation. the cost of this concession if that is what it was needs further scrutiny. This examination should include setting up of Maynooth seminary, how it was structured and why the Northern protestants misunderstood the government and voted them out of…</p>
<p>Thank you again Joe Many thoughts come to mind on the forty shilling payment, and much of which is a hazy memory of post school history. I am reminded of the difficulty the Duke of Wellington and PM Peele? had in granting Catholic Emancipation. the cost of this concession if that is what it was needs further scrutiny. This examination should include setting up of Maynooth seminary, how it was structured and why the Northern protestants misunderstood the government and voted them out of office. Was Maynooth for instance a form of bank for landlords who were in difficulty. Did Daniel O'Connell act in the interests of Catholic landholders when he abolished the 40 shilling holdings and streamlined the legal system making it more 'efficient' in evicting Catholic and other poorer classes of tenant? Was the concession of Catholic Emancipation weighted against the seething anger of Catholics who could have considered revolting in the face of having to pay tithes for the upkeep of Protestant clergymen?</p> Thank you Joe for this fine a…tag:thewildgeese.irish,2016-09-24:6442157:Comment:2001612016-09-24T16:20:20.776Zmichael dunnehttps://thewildgeese.irish/profile/michaeldunne
<p>Thank you Joe for this fine and important aspect of 19th C Irish history. I will be revisiting it for further study. Maybe you have read thae excellent book Captain Rock and the Agrarian Rebellion of 1821/ 24 by J.R. Donnelly Prof Emeritus Madison Wisconsin? He explains the real reasons behind the misunderstood Faction Fighting pointing out it was really a class war generally represented by the Caravats who were the champions of the poor/ the tenant cottiers and the Shanavests who…</p>
<p>Thank you Joe for this fine and important aspect of 19th C Irish history. I will be revisiting it for further study. Maybe you have read thae excellent book Captain Rock and the Agrarian Rebellion of 1821/ 24 by J.R. Donnelly Prof Emeritus Madison Wisconsin? He explains the real reasons behind the misunderstood Faction Fighting pointing out it was really a class war generally represented by the Caravats who were the champions of the poor/ the tenant cottiers and the Shanavests who represented the wealthier 'Snug' farmers and landlord/middlemen class. He is a first rate scholar of 19th C Irish history and this work helps explain exactly what led to the Tithe Wars...The Land League...Home Rule and eventually the War of Independence.</p>
<p>I dont want to spoil the read but Captain Rock was a blacksmith eventually emigrating to the US after turning informer. Later when we got our independence, the Irish Free State took over the workings of the Land Commission and were favourably disposed to the treatite forces when it came to the redistribution of this addtional million acres of land and the £30 million loan from the British Govt. Over the next couple of decades there were 400, 000 letters of complaint from farmers about other farmers not adhering to the conditions of their rental purchase. The hope was these complained of would be thrown off their land and the complainants might gain somehow.These small minded complaints were an embarrassment and on order of Government they were all pulped, and a real chance of knowing the truer nature of rural and perhaps urban Ireland was squandered.</p>
<p>When de Valera got power in 1933 he picked a row with britain over the repayment of these land annuities, as most of the beneficiaries of both land and loans were from the opposite political camp. Britain responded and as you know an embargo /tax levy was placed on all Irish agricultural produce. Many Snug farmers went bankrupt, which was music to de Valeras ears, giving him the opportunity of acquiring these 100 acre plus holdings and redistributing them into 25 acre farms among the less well off. This was to be a winning strategy for de Valera for decades. </p>
<p>Another aside was the dislike for the retired RIC in these times as they were also in receipt of large pension settlements which gave them a great advantage in buying up the land. They were generally of farming background and had to be vouched for on entry by A wealthy farmer or District Justice. For the most part they were instruments of Dublin Castle, a paramilitary Force and policing without consent. In the South more than 90% of its members were Catholic even though less than 10% of their number ever saw promotion.So I suppose one could say that a policemans lot was not a happy one (In Ireland) The 'Bobby' was an affectionate nickname for a policeman in England but in Ireland it was a 'Peeler' This is associated with the founder of the constabulary Robert Peele.</p>
<p>I am from an urban background but find it very difficult to identify sources for how the urban poor fared in the 19th and 20th Centuries. I know they had some protection from the Land League but would appreciate any information.</p>
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<p></p> You shouldn't write such thin…tag:thewildgeese.irish,2016-05-12:6442157:Comment:1919302016-05-12T05:39:57.551ZPatrick Francis Deadyhttps://thewildgeese.irish/profile/PatrickFrancisDeady
<p>You shouldn't write such things, Joe. It just stirs me up and I want to smack somebody !! Thanks for the telling though.</p>
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<p>You shouldn't write such things, Joe. It just stirs me up and I want to smack somebody !! Thanks for the telling though.</p>
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<p></p> Thanks for posting, I had no…tag:thewildgeese.irish,2016-05-08:6442157:Comment:1915082016-05-08T17:39:52.431ZJean Sullivan Cardinalhttps://thewildgeese.irish/profile/JeanSullivanCardinal
<p>Thanks for posting, I had no idea.</p>
<p>Thanks for posting, I had no idea.</p> Great article! Filled in som…tag:thewildgeese.irish,2016-05-08:6442157:Comment:1912092016-05-08T13:50:19.963ZDouglas S. Harthttps://thewildgeese.irish/profile/DouglasSHart
<p>Great article! Filled in some blanks for me. Thanks!</p>
<p>Great article! Filled in some blanks for me. Thanks!</p>